Guns

[cheeseburger]

Louis saved me once again.

[classthe_king]

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvintl.html

"In 1993 a Swiss professor, Martin Killias, published a study of 18 countries concerning gun ownership, homicide and suicide. He in part concluded there was a weak correlation between total homicide and gun ownership. For a partial criticism of his study see Dunblane Misled where using the countries studied by Killias, these researchers found a much stronger correlation between firearm homicides and car ownership. More seriously, when the United States was included in the Killias study, a stronger correlation between total homicide and gun ownership was found. When two countries were excluded, the U.S. (high gun ownership, high murder rate) and Northern Ireland (low gun ownership, high murder rate) the correlation was marginally significant. Gary Kleck writes, "Contrary to his claim that 'the overall correlation is not contingent upon a few countries with extreme scores on the dependent and independent variable', reanalysis of the data reveals that if one excludes only the United States from the sample there is no significant association between gun ownership and the total homicide rate." (Kleck, Targeting Guns: Firearms and Their Control, p 253. Walter de Gruyter, Inc. New York, 1997.) Kleck concludes that "the homicide-guns study was not international at all, but merely reflected the unique status of the United States as a high-gun ownership/high-violence nation...Since the positive association Killias observed was entirely dependent on the U.S. case, where self-defense is a common reason for gun ownership, this supports the conclusion that the association was attributable to the impact of the homicide rates on gun levels."

[CrashBand]

Didn't read class' response but lol @ cheeseburger taking hims serious with the walking dead.

Had a serious lol.

[CrashBand]

Class, I think we know that it's the USA's culture that is the problem - not the sole fact they have loose gun ownership laws - but, don't you think changing the ownership laws could go some way as to changing the fucked up culture.

[classthe_king]

Depends on how we changed them

[UofLCard]

My mom's boyfriend was telling about how, in the near future, guns will be designed to where only the gun owners (with clean backgrounds, I assume) will be able to fire them. I think the guns will be able to read fingerprints. This is excellent if marketed.

[SliK]

My mom's boyfriend was telling about how, in the near future, guns will be designed to where only the gun owners (with clean backgrounds, I assume) will be able to fire them. I think the guns will be able to read fingerprints. This is excellent if marketed.

Is your mum dating James Bond?

[SliK]

Haven't read anything in this thread but I think the right to bear arms is a beautiful thing and should be in all countries, people just need to be mentally tested before they can buy one tbh.

Nooo, I'm quite happy that there are no assult rifle owners on my street.

[cheeseburger]

Haven't read anything in this thread but I think the right to bear arms is a beautiful thing and should be in all countries, people just need to be mentally tested before they can buy one tbh.

Fine, but guns can go of by accident to. Or a child can find it.

Lets say theres a big brawl at the neighbor next door. You hate this neighbor and have been struggeling with him over the last 4 years. You have enouh and think that you should go over there with your legally owned gun just to scare some sense into him.
You start waving your gun around and telling him to shut up. Someone of his friends sees you and thinks youre serious, so he pulls out his guns and shot are being fired all around.

This could happen right now, it isnt that crazy. But it wouldnt happen if noone had guns at home or on them.

[classthe_king]

Haven't read anything in this thread but I think the right to bear arms is a beautiful thing and should be in all countries, people just need to be mentally tested before they can buy one tbh.

Fine, but guns can go of by accident to. Or a child can find it.

Lets say theres a big brawl at the neighbor next door. You hate this neighbor and have been struggeling with him over the last 4 years. You have enouh and think that you should go over there with your legally owned gun just to scare some sense into him.
You start waving your gun around and telling him to shut up. Someone of his friends sees you and thinks youre serious, so he pulls out his guns and shot are being fired all around.

This could happen right now, it isnt that crazy. But it wouldnt happen if noone had guns at home or on them.

wtf are you talking about. If you think making up crazy outlandish stories that might happen is an argument against something then

[AbramIsaac]

Cheese, that scenario might not sound so strange to you, but you're from a different culture. I don't want to use that argument to say you can't understand American gun owners, but I do want to make it clear that your perception isn't that of someone that owns a gun. Why is this important?

When you own a gun, you know what guns can do. You also know the reaction people have when seeing a gun, and unless you're out of your mind, you're not going to be waving it around like a crazy person. You certainly don't "scare some sense" into anyone with your guns, especially if they aren't directly threatening you. That's how you get fucking killed.

What a normal person does, a sane person would do...is call the cops. If it's that bad, anyway. I don't like the idea of calling the police myself, so I don't think I would call them. If someone else wanted to, fine, but unless they were directly affecting me, I'm not going to call the cops, and I'm certainly not going to go over there with a gun and get myself killed.

[UofLCard]

When all is said and done, a gun ban scenario would do little for this country. Criminals will find a way to get their hands on them. Prohibition in the 1920s didn't stop people from getting alcohol.

[classthe_king]

Guys I was just thinking...If a guy was crazy and wanted to scare his neighbor he might walk over to his house with a baseball bat. Not to hit him but just to wave it around and scare him. Not harm was intended but what if the guys kid heard the fight and came downstairs and saw some guy waving a baseball bat at his dad? He would probably grab a frying pan and hit that guy over the head and kill him. Therefore, I think baseball bats and frying pans should be illegal.

[cheeseburger]

Yes we astablished that any object can be used for killing like ten times in this thread already. Childish argument. But guns are not made to use in the kitchen as a cookingdevice, or on a field as a ballhitter etc...
They are made for killing. Thats their main purpose. But then people like you like to put a pretty bow on it and make them sound as the saviour of all problems. And you will never see that its actually the guns that are the problem. Well they are one of the problems.

This is so typical for americans. You know something is fucked up in your country, but because guns is a big part of the problem you dont want to change anything. Youre scared your beloved guns will go away.

Just imagine now, only imagine that you live in a world were guns are only for law enforcement and sadly enough a couple bad guys here and there. But these bad guys only really bother themselfs, so they are really never any real threat to ordinary people. Would you like to live in this world? I think so.

[classthe_king]

Yes we astablished that any object can be used for killing like ten times in this thread already. Childish argument. But guns are not made to use in the kitchen as a cookingdevice, or on a field as a ballhitter etc...
They are made for killing. Thats their main purpose. But then people like you like to put a pretty bow on it and make them sound as the saviour of all problems. And you will never see that its actually the guns that are the problem. Well they are one of the problems.

This is so typical for americans. You know something is fucked up in your country, but because guns is a big part of the problem you dont want to change anything. Youre scared your beloved guns will go away.

Well this entire argument was a gigantic straw man

Just imagine now, only imagine that you live in a world were guns are only for law enforcement and sadly enough a couple bad guys here and there. But these bad guys only really bother themselfs, so they are really never any real threat to ordinary people. Would you like to live in this world? I think so.

Yes I would also like to live in this world...except this is what's called a Utopia (or close to it) and will never exist. Bad guys only bother themselves and aren't a threat to ordinary people? How naive and ignorant about the real world are you?